Talk:Belgian

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Belgium

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On 25 December 2021, it was proposed that this article be moved from Belgian (disambiguation) to Belgian. The result of the discussion was moved.

Should this page be a redirect to Belgium?

I sincerely think it shouldn't. Otherwise it could be very difficult for someone looking for the topic "Belgian (horse)" to find it. While someone looking for Belgian (citizen) will always find its way to Belgium thanks to the disambig page. To my humble opinion. --Edcolins 21:23, Oct 7, 2004 (UTC)

We have a set policy for dealing with these situations. Paris does not disambig to Paris, Ontario. St. Petersburg goes straight to the one in Russia, with a separate page pointing to St. Petersburg, Florida. In general a term needs to refer to an alternate meaning 20% of the time to justify a disambig page. Otherwise it just gets pointed to from a line on the top of the main article. - SimonP 21:35, Oct 7, 2004 (UTC)

This policy does not apply to this case, since there is no proper article on Belgian, the citizen of Belgium, but rather a redirect to Belgium's article. Specifically, the "Primary topic" disambiguation policy does not apply to Belgian while it does apply to Belgium (disambiguation)/Belgium. Again, someone looking for Belgian, the horse, would have no way to even find the article he is looking for if there would be no disambiguation page for Belgian. He would have to go from Belgium to Belgium (disambiguation) to eventually find the article. --Edcolins 21:57, Oct 7, 2004 (UTC)

There are no proper article at St. Petersburg, Toronto, or many other articles with separate disambig pages. The standard rules apply to these and to Belgian. - SimonP 22:03, Oct 7, 2004 (UTC)

Some more examples:

All then disambig based on their redirects - SimonP 22:10, Oct 7, 2004 (UTC)

Okay... but with the intro in Belgium linking to the horse (in conformance with your examples). That's a fair solution. It is not what you had done initially though ;) [1]. I think we have a deal now... --Edcolins 22:21, Oct 7, 2004 (UTC)

Requested move 25 December 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. There is a rough consensus that there is no primary topic and as such the disambiguation page should be at the base title. (closed by non-admin page mover) Lennart97 (talk) 14:30, 1 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Belgian (disambiguation) → Belgian – Belgian is currently a redirect to Belgians, a page that explains Belgian people. But this redirect is ambiguous and it could mean many other things like Belgian language, something related to Belgium, etc. I think the current Belgian (disambiguation) should be moved to Belgian so that pages will be disambiguated on that page, at the same time eliminating the redirect of Belgian, which is not unique to Belgian people. Dragoniez (talk) 05:41, 25 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support Belgian horse gets 3,653 views compared with 5,814 for Belgians and some other alternatives get more[[2]]. Crouch, Swale (talk) 10:33, 25 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Retarget DAB page to Belgium giving "Belgian" or "Belgians" are demonyms for the country named Belgium. I oppose the page move, but retarget to correct page feels reasonable. 125.167.59.84 (talk) 14:19, 25 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- I oppose your idea for the reasons I already provided. "Belgian" isn't unique to one concept. --Dragoniez (talk) 00:59, 26 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support per nomination, per Crouch, Swale and per WP:CONSISTENT — Afghan, Albanian, Algerian, Andorran, Angolan, Antiguan, Armenian, Austrian, Azerbaijani, Bahamian, Bahraini, Barbadian, Belarusian, Belizean, Bolivian, Bosnian, Brazilian, Bruneian, Bulgarian or Cambodian, to name but twenty — are all dab pages that do not use the parenthetical qualifier "(disambiguation)", therefore confirming that WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS to an extremely high degree, with Belgian (disambiguation) being an exception. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 04:53, 26 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: WikiProject Disambiguation has been notified of this discussion. — Shibbolethink ^(♔ ^♕) 17:31, 26 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support. There is no primary topic here. Rreagan007 (talk) 21:46, 27 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. This page is a disambiguation page and should keep its title per MOS:DABPAGENAME. Belgian can keep redirecting to Belgians as it is its primary topic per WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Hosortyr (talk) 01:04, 28 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
- @Hosortyr: No offense but your comment makes me wonder if you know that a DAB page doesn't need to have a "disambiguation" qualifier in the title. --Dragoniez (talk) 05:28, 28 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your comment. I'm not offensed. I based my comment on what I read in MOS:DABPAGENAME. "If there is already a primary topic, "(disambiguation)" should be added to the title of the disambiguation page". In this case, the Belgian people is clearly the primary topic. Moreover, as a reader, the "(disambiguation)" qualifer allowed me to quickly understand it's a DAB page. Hosortyr (talk) 16:05, 28 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If you think that there is a primary topic/redirect that's fine. But the "(disambiguation)" title disambiguator isn't used on disambiguation pages that have no primary topic/redirect. Rreagan007 (talk) 17:46, 28 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

See WP:DABNAME and WP:MALPLACED, the other uses come up in the search box so if someone is clicking on the title with no "(disambiguation)" as opposed to one of the other uses its probably because they've not wanted on of the other uses rathan than thinking this page is one of them. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:50, 28 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Support (pretty uncontroversial) per nom; Crouch, Swale; Roman Spinner. Llew Mawr (talk) 00:12, 29 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Support per Roman Spinner and others. User:力 (powera, π, ν) 19:32, 29 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Post-close comment: any help with disambiguating the 1500+ incoming links is appreciated. Lennart97 (talk) 14:34, 1 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]